There's no point in stressing too much about learning Portuguese slowly.
For us, the real question is not how good your Portuguese is, but your attitude. That's what separates "those Americans" from that funny guy who makes a few linguistic lapses. A woman who comes into a patisserie and asks for a coffee and a "queca" instead of a "queque"? That will make every employee's day and there will be second-guessing jokes for days. Now that's integrating yourself into the culture without realising it. Next time, the staff will greet you with a smile and ask: do you want the same?
Thanks for this perspective, Paulo. That’s comforting to know. We’d like to have a great attitude and fluency, of course, but we can at least control the former for now while we work toward the latter.
Olá! Sorry to jump in in your exchange. But “pau” is secondly a slang word. The main meaning is stick… (not sure if you are aware of it, sorry for assuming in advance) but I understand your concern. A far more complex mistake is to say “queque” (muffin) with an “a” in the end instead of the “e” then you would get either a laugh or a side eye.
I, too, have said Obrigada instead of Ola or Bom Dia. I've also thanked people for letting me run into them (when Desculpe would have been more appropriate). A lot of times, when I say (in Portuguese) that "I'm still learning", people will speak slower and also say things in Portuguese and the English translation. A recent win, for me, was starting to say "Até próxima semana" at the farmers market. I usually go to the same vendors and they noticed that I didn't just end with my usual Obrigada!
Haha! I thought I was the only one. Yeah, mixing things up definitely helps. I feel so basic when I repeatedly say the same few phrases to people at our neighborhood mercado.
This was an interesting essay about how much difficulty there is in merely learning conversational Portuguese in a class compared to listening to people speak it quickly.
Your journey will most likely make you bilingual eventually.🌹
From the bottom of my heart as a polyglot, don’t even bother to fixate on accent.
Every accent is cute - even natives have their own original accent (from Porto, Madeira, Alentejo the easiest to pick, alongside the “malandro” from Lisbon downtown). The other secret? Start learning another language too: the more, the easier!
Really!? Never even considered trying to learn two languages at once. We were just joking the other day that we should be learning French instead, since there's so much French spoken in our neighborhood (Campo de Ourique). Maybe we'll start learning both!
Ah, thank you for the relatable tales about trying to connect. For me, as a newcomer to Montréal, it’s not just French, but also the distinct Quebecois dialect on top of that. Urban places are quite bilingual, which is both a fortunate (for basic communication) and unfortunate (for learning the language) crutch. What I find hard is not being able to overhear public conversations as a “fly on the wall.” Connection is critical for us humans and not understanding passersby can be isolating. And not being able to respond frustrating. One wants to honor the local language… it’s a kind of respect for the culture, at least for me.
Almost a year in I have a long way to go in terms of learning, yet I’m beginning to see small yet significant progress. Interestingly, I find reading French to be progressing more quickly (in part because I’m a student of Latin and Ancient Greek and know some Spanish and Italian). Hearing and pronouncing it is a whole other endeavor!
Yeah, living in such a bilingual city really is a blessing and a curse. It's great at first because it makes the transition so much easier, but I think we would probably learn the language much quicker if we were truly forced to speak Portuguese everywhere we went.
Haha! Cursing in another language is so fun. I know a couple swear words in Portuguese but need to learn more.
Yes, when you learn how one curses, it can be a whole new window into the soul of a culture and of a people. You don't necessarily get that in official or formal language instruction.
Here in Québec, much cursing is based on the church's liturgy. Now here is a story!
I remember once attempting to order food, in French, at McDonalds in France. After several exasperating attempts to understand me, the server, visibly frustrated, curtly asked me - in English - if I spoke English. And that’s how I ordered, ending her ordeal.
I suppose learning to speak a foreign language is at least as difficult as learning to read music and play a musical instrument well. I’m sure you’ll be riffing before you know it.
Haha! Yeah, English being so well-known here has gotten us out of so many situations just like the one you described. Makes me appreciate immigrants who don't have the luxury of English as a fallback all the more.
Olá Cody! What a beautiful essay, full of saudade. I applaud your and your wife’s dedication to working on everyday Portuguese.
I had to learn Italian to communicate with my Italian family who I unearthed and visited in their homes (all my dad’s 10 surviving first cousins), so I well know the embarrassment of the early stage of language learning.
I visited Portugal for 15 days in January and as a language nerd, I worked hard to learn as much “street” Portuguese as possible. I can recommend a source, Liz Sharma, who has a very effective way of teaching. If I were actually relocating to Portugal, I would definitely continue with Liz!
Thanks so much, Karen! That’s so kind of you to say. I know of Liz well! Have taken some of her lessons already and have found them very helpful. Great recommendation!
Keep on keeping on! I know it’s really challenging (as someone who grew up around the Portuguese language but only formally learned it as an adult). You will learn so much about yourself and others by pushing through the inevitable mistakes and discomforts. The thing about fluency, is the more you learn the more you realize you aren’t fluent. It can takes years to learn all of the nuances and specific ways of speaking. I still struggle with certain idioms. Sounds like you are both doing great only a few months in!
Thanks for the encouragement, Lena! That’s a great point about learning more to realize how much you don’t know. Hadn’t thought of it that way but it explains a lot. Had been feeling like we were plateauing for a while but maybe that was actually progress. I felt like we had so much momentum early on when we were learning basic greetings and phrases, but probably just because we were getting all the low-hanging fruit. Expanding beyond that has revealed the full scope of what we still have to learn, which can be a bit deflating. But maybe it shouldn’t be.
Learning a new language comes with so many ups and downs. It’s okay to plateau. There is always another breakthrough on the other side of that effort. I also try to remind myself that there is a level that allows you to communicate, which is really the goal anyways and the rest is a bonus. And the only way to get better is to keep putting yourself in situations.
4 years into my move to Spain and I still feel like I'm floundering most of the time when I'm met with fluent locals. But I've found that you get used to the embarrassment, and powering through is the quickest route to improvement. It will continue to feel like a struggle, (and I'm convinced that Spanish verb conjunction is some sort of sick practical joke) but one day you'll look back and notice just how much you've improved, and that feeling of pride is awesome.
Thanks so much for that encouragement, Luke! Going to try to remember to look at those embarrassing moments as opportunities to power through going forward.
Sounds like you are progressing with your language skills at a great pace! I love those small victories and choose to ignore the number of times I’ve mispronounced “pão.”
The victories are so sweet, ha. You kind of just have to blunder through it because without speaking regularly you don’t progress. But man, it’s humbling to realize your classroom level and real life level are very different.
There's no point in stressing too much about learning Portuguese slowly.
For us, the real question is not how good your Portuguese is, but your attitude. That's what separates "those Americans" from that funny guy who makes a few linguistic lapses. A woman who comes into a patisserie and asks for a coffee and a "queca" instead of a "queque"? That will make every employee's day and there will be second-guessing jokes for days. Now that's integrating yourself into the culture without realising it. Next time, the staff will greet you with a smile and ask: do you want the same?
Thanks for this perspective, Paulo. That’s comforting to know. We’d like to have a great attitude and fluency, of course, but we can at least control the former for now while we work toward the latter.
I didn’t realize the pitfalls of mispronouncing pão! Thanks for the warning.
Haha yeah it’s a pretty typical one. Glad those who read about my mistakes won’t have to duplicate them!
Olá! Sorry to jump in in your exchange. But “pau” is secondly a slang word. The main meaning is stick… (not sure if you are aware of it, sorry for assuming in advance) but I understand your concern. A far more complex mistake is to say “queque” (muffin) with an “a” in the end instead of the “e” then you would get either a laugh or a side eye.
Haha, thankfully, we asked how to pronounce "queque" before ordering one. It's Ashley's favorite treat at the quiosque.
I, too, have said Obrigada instead of Ola or Bom Dia. I've also thanked people for letting me run into them (when Desculpe would have been more appropriate). A lot of times, when I say (in Portuguese) that "I'm still learning", people will speak slower and also say things in Portuguese and the English translation. A recent win, for me, was starting to say "Até próxima semana" at the farmers market. I usually go to the same vendors and they noticed that I didn't just end with my usual Obrigada!
Haha! I thought I was the only one. Yeah, mixing things up definitely helps. I feel so basic when I repeatedly say the same few phrases to people at our neighborhood mercado.
cherish those small moments of success!
This was an interesting essay about how much difficulty there is in merely learning conversational Portuguese in a class compared to listening to people speak it quickly.
Your journey will most likely make you bilingual eventually.🌹
From the bottom of my heart as a polyglot, don’t even bother to fixate on accent.
Every accent is cute - even natives have their own original accent (from Porto, Madeira, Alentejo the easiest to pick, alongside the “malandro” from Lisbon downtown). The other secret? Start learning another language too: the more, the easier!
Really!? Never even considered trying to learn two languages at once. We were just joking the other day that we should be learning French instead, since there's so much French spoken in our neighborhood (Campo de Ourique). Maybe we'll start learning both!
Indeed, there’s a whole French community between Campo and Sao Bento, it’s useful to integrate :)
Ah, thank you for the relatable tales about trying to connect. For me, as a newcomer to Montréal, it’s not just French, but also the distinct Quebecois dialect on top of that. Urban places are quite bilingual, which is both a fortunate (for basic communication) and unfortunate (for learning the language) crutch. What I find hard is not being able to overhear public conversations as a “fly on the wall.” Connection is critical for us humans and not understanding passersby can be isolating. And not being able to respond frustrating. One wants to honor the local language… it’s a kind of respect for the culture, at least for me.
Almost a year in I have a long way to go in terms of learning, yet I’m beginning to see small yet significant progress. Interestingly, I find reading French to be progressing more quickly (in part because I’m a student of Latin and Ancient Greek and know some Spanish and Italian). Hearing and pronouncing it is a whole other endeavor!
P.S. learning to swear can be uplifting! 😸
Yeah, living in such a bilingual city really is a blessing and a curse. It's great at first because it makes the transition so much easier, but I think we would probably learn the language much quicker if we were truly forced to speak Portuguese everywhere we went.
Haha! Cursing in another language is so fun. I know a couple swear words in Portuguese but need to learn more.
Yes, when you learn how one curses, it can be a whole new window into the soul of a culture and of a people. You don't necessarily get that in official or formal language instruction.
Here in Québec, much cursing is based on the church's liturgy. Now here is a story!
I remember once attempting to order food, in French, at McDonalds in France. After several exasperating attempts to understand me, the server, visibly frustrated, curtly asked me - in English - if I spoke English. And that’s how I ordered, ending her ordeal.
I suppose learning to speak a foreign language is at least as difficult as learning to read music and play a musical instrument well. I’m sure you’ll be riffing before you know it.
Haha! Yeah, English being so well-known here has gotten us out of so many situations just like the one you described. Makes me appreciate immigrants who don't have the luxury of English as a fallback all the more.
Olá Cody! What a beautiful essay, full of saudade. I applaud your and your wife’s dedication to working on everyday Portuguese.
I had to learn Italian to communicate with my Italian family who I unearthed and visited in their homes (all my dad’s 10 surviving first cousins), so I well know the embarrassment of the early stage of language learning.
I visited Portugal for 15 days in January and as a language nerd, I worked hard to learn as much “street” Portuguese as possible. I can recommend a source, Liz Sharma, who has a very effective way of teaching. If I were actually relocating to Portugal, I would definitely continue with Liz!
https://youtube.com/@talkthestreets?si=uNtBFyNT-F-1e7Ba
Thanks so much, Karen! That’s so kind of you to say. I know of Liz well! Have taken some of her lessons already and have found them very helpful. Great recommendation!
So glad you’ve already found Liz, Cody! Yes, she’s a great resource. Boa sorte com os seus estudos de português!
Keep on keeping on! I know it’s really challenging (as someone who grew up around the Portuguese language but only formally learned it as an adult). You will learn so much about yourself and others by pushing through the inevitable mistakes and discomforts. The thing about fluency, is the more you learn the more you realize you aren’t fluent. It can takes years to learn all of the nuances and specific ways of speaking. I still struggle with certain idioms. Sounds like you are both doing great only a few months in!
Thanks for the encouragement, Lena! That’s a great point about learning more to realize how much you don’t know. Hadn’t thought of it that way but it explains a lot. Had been feeling like we were plateauing for a while but maybe that was actually progress. I felt like we had so much momentum early on when we were learning basic greetings and phrases, but probably just because we were getting all the low-hanging fruit. Expanding beyond that has revealed the full scope of what we still have to learn, which can be a bit deflating. But maybe it shouldn’t be.
Learning a new language comes with so many ups and downs. It’s okay to plateau. There is always another breakthrough on the other side of that effort. I also try to remind myself that there is a level that allows you to communicate, which is really the goal anyways and the rest is a bonus. And the only way to get better is to keep putting yourself in situations.
4 years into my move to Spain and I still feel like I'm floundering most of the time when I'm met with fluent locals. But I've found that you get used to the embarrassment, and powering through is the quickest route to improvement. It will continue to feel like a struggle, (and I'm convinced that Spanish verb conjunction is some sort of sick practical joke) but one day you'll look back and notice just how much you've improved, and that feeling of pride is awesome.
Thanks so much for that encouragement, Luke! Going to try to remember to look at those embarrassing moments as opportunities to power through going forward.
Sounds like you are progressing with your language skills at a great pace! I love those small victories and choose to ignore the number of times I’ve mispronounced “pão.”
Thanks so much, Lani! It's comforting to know we're not alone in our struggles.
The victories are so sweet, ha. You kind of just have to blunder through it because without speaking regularly you don’t progress. But man, it’s humbling to realize your classroom level and real life level are very different.
They really are! The embarrassing blunders are rough in the moment but they make the small victories even sweeter.